You can watch today’s hearing live, below:
The secretary of the Department of Health and Human Services, Kym Peake, has returned to the (virtual) stand again after fronting the inquiry yesterday. She is being questioned by counsel assisting the inquiry Ben Ihle.
Just picking up on some evidence that was heard earlier …
We heard that Police Minister Lisa Neville learnt that Emergency Management Commissioner Andrew Crisp had requested the support of 850 defence force troops when she read the front page of a newspaper. Ms Neville said she was “pretty cranky” about it because she thought Mr Crisp would have given her a heads-up.
Emails between department staff showed they were a little worried about what Ms Neville was going to say.
Rebecca Faulkington from the Department of Justice wrote a concerned email to Kym Peake, secretary of the Department of Health and Human Services, on the morning of June 25, the day the story was published.
“I worry it will have a strong reaction from Neville,” Ms Faulkington write.
Ms Neville told the inquiry she did not have a firm view about the role of the ADF, but did feel strongly about the “need to engage with VicPol and PSOs [Protective Service Officers]”.
“I did have a strong view that Victoria Police should be at the table, from the start of any conversation around enforcement,” she said.
Jobs Minister Martin Pakula and Police Minister Lisa Neville have both pointed the finger at the Health Department, saying it was in charge of the hotel quarantine program that led to Victoria’s second coronavirus wave.
It comes just a day after Health Department secretary Kym Peake told the hotel quarantine inquiry there was shared accountability. Ms Peake is about to return to the (virtual) stand.
- Ms Neville joins the rapidly growing group of people claiming ignorance about how the decision to hire private security guards over police of defence force troops was made: “I do not know who made the decision to engage private security contractors,” the minister’s witness statement reads.
- The minister also resisted the charge that the decision to hire the guards was responsible for what later went wrong: “I do not know whether that was because of the use of private security at all, or because of issues with the management and oversight of the private security arrangements, infection control management, or both.”
- That’s evidenced she said by two police officers contracting COVID-19 while working at locked-down public housing towers in Melbourne in July.
- Ms Neville said Emergency Management Commissioner Andrew Crisp first mentioned private security to her in a meeting about the hotel quarantine program at about 2pm on March 27 – the day the system was being set up.
- Ms Neville, Mr Crisp and Chief Commissioner Graham Ashton had a regular meeting scheduled for 2pm that day, just after National Cabinet decided to quarantine international arrivals, but she said it was an “information sharing” meeting, not one where decisions were made.
That concludes Lisa Neville’s evidence to the inquiry today.
At 2.15pm, the Department of Health and Human Services secretary Kym Peake will return to the stand to continue giving evidence, after fronting the inquiry yesterday.
Ms Peake’s appearance comes after Ms Neville and Jobs Minister Martin Pakula agreed the Health Department was the “control agency” in the hotel quarantine program, which should make for some interesting questioning, so do stay with us.
Here is a copy of the notes former police chief Graham Ashton made during his March 27 meeting with Emergency Management Commissioner Andrew Crisp and Police Minister Lisa Neville.
Note the words “security guards” and “police back up”.
Also, “ADF” is written on the right side of the page.
Police Minister Lisa Neville said former police chief Graham Ashton should have been consulted about the use of private security guards in quarantine hotels.
Mr Ashton has in effect told the inquiry he was not consulted and it was “presented to him as a decision that had already been made”.
“Does it surprise you that a decision about enforcement of this kind would have been made without reference to the chief commissioner, having regard to his responsibilities for law enforcement and public safety in Victoria?” counsel assisting the inquiry, Rachel Ellyard, asked Ms Neville.
Ms Neville replied: “Well, it is my expectation that he should have been consulted about it.”
The minister said that if there had been any serious consideration about using Victoria Police as the first line of security in hotel quarantine, then she expected she also would have been told.
“I also am of the view, given my relationship and how we operated with the chief commissioner, that if there had been serious consideration and consultation with him, he would have also had a conversation with me,” Ms Neville said.
Two police officers contracted coronavirus while working at locked-down public housing towers, Police Minister Lisa Neville has told the inquiry.
Ms Neville was asked if any issues were raised by the police union about the safety of police working in COVID-19 hotels.
She said no issues were raised about the COVID hotels, but two officers contracted the virus while policing the public housing towers which were placed in a hard lockdown in July.
Police were later deployed to patrol two hotels used to isolate COVID-positive guests after Victoria’s quarantine program was suspended for returned travellers in late June, but Ms Neville said the Police Association had not raised any concerns.
Lisa Neville said she didn’t find out Victoria had requested the help of the Australian Defence Force in quarantine hotels until she read the front page of a newspaper.
In late June, Emergency Management Commissioner Andrew Crisp made a formal request for 850 troops to replace private security after COVID-19 outbreaks had occurred in the hotels.
Ms Neville told the inquiry she didn’t find out about it until she read it on the front page of the Herald Sun.
She said she “didn’t have a particular view about it”, but “I would have liked to have known about the request”.
Mr Crisp rescinded his request that same day, with a decision later made to bring in Corrections Victoria officers.
The news sparked a series of text messages between Ms Neville and Mr Crisp that morning.
“The use of army in hotels? That was not agreed to at CCc yesterday but is that we doing? And what will they be doing?” Ms Neville texted.
Ms Neville told the inquiry: “The texts indicate I was a bit surprised and I was trying to receive clarity about what I had read in the paper.”
She said finding out about an expanded ADF role from the media left her “pretty cranky”.
She texted Mr Crisp: “Not sure what they do at hotels given no one leaves!! And they have no powers.”
Ms Neville told the inquiry that at the time she sent the text message to Mr Crisp she was “still slightly cranky that I had discovered the whole thing by the Herald Sun article just after midnight”.
“I was still relatively annoyed about it,” she said.
“I think that probably more reflects I was pretty cranky at that point.”
She said she was concerned ADF personnel had no powers to enforce hotel quarantine.
Police and Emergency Services Minister Lisa Neville says she cannot be sure that all the problems with Victoria’s hotel quarantine program can be chalked-up to the original decision to hire private security guards. It might be more complicated than that, her witness statement to the inquiry indicates.
“Reflecting on the question now, there are clearly things that went wrong with the Hotels Quarantine Program,” the minister’s statement reads.
“I do not know whether that was because of the use of private security at all, or because of issues with the management and oversight of the private security arrangements, infection control management, or both.”
Police Minister Lisa Neville said she believes then-chief commissioner Graham Ashton talked about a potential role for the Australian Defence Force in hotel quarantine at that March 27 key meeting.
Ms Neville, Mr Ashton and Emergency Management Commissioner Andrew Crisp met about 2pm, two days before the first international arrivals were quarantined in Victoria.
The minister said she remembers Mr Ashton talking about the ADF. She said they talked mainly about the potential role for the ADF in escorting passengers from the airport when they arrived.
She was then shown a text sent that day by Kate Houghton, deputy secretary of the Department of Premier and Cabinet to Mr Crisp.
The text response from Mr Crisp said: “My minister has some idea of ADF role and that’s what we’re discussing with Graham Ashton at the moment.”
Ms Neville said: “It was not me providing the idea of [an] ADF role because I’m very clear that there had been no conversation around the ADF role until that meeting.”
She said no decisions were made at the meeting, rather it was an “information sharing” exercise.
Ms Neville said she didn’t have a particular view about the use of the ADF, only that the “reality is” troops do not share the powers of Australian Federal Police and Victoria Police officers.
Mr Crisp told another meeting later that day he was satisfied Victoria had the capacity to deal with all aspects of the operation and didn’t see the need for “ADF boots on the ground”.
Ms Neville said the only conversation she had with Mr Crisp was at the 2pm meeting. She did not speak to him about hotel quarantine over the course of the weekend.